In real life, if someone got a black hoodie and a mask and decided to “fight crime”, how successful would they be?
Finding it in the first place would be hard, and getting there faster than evenly-distributed squad cars would be even harder.
Then once they get there, more often than not beating an individual person up isn’t the solution - even if it’s a domestic, the victims have a way of sticking up for the abuser. Or maybe it’s a dispute and you’re not sure who the bad guy is, and you’d need some kind of court system to work it out anyway.
In real life where those problems can’t be written out, you’ve basically taken everything the police are criticised for and amplified it.
You could specialize in types of crime the cops don’t usually get involved in, like corporate wage theft.
You need lawyers to fight that, not vigilantes
Vigilante lawyers?
Edit: Yeah, not really vigilante but still…
Practicing law… without a license
It’s true, this isn’t Mario and the money won’t come out just from jumping on them.
What if it’s Luigi?
I was gonna say. I know one CEO that isn’t stealing anyone’s wages anymore.
You have to hold them upside down and shake them for the money to fall out of their pockets.
Someone that fights through the layers of security guards until reaching the final boss of the CEO might change the CEO’s mind with some physical persuasion.
Low level individual crimes wouldn’t be practical. Probably more worthwhile to try to follow more reliable organised crime or repeat offending criminals or something. Although even that wouldn’t practical as an individual without serious investigative resources and you’d still probably end up dead pretty quickly.
The only successful vigilantism is probably the online entrapment of paedophiles or something of that sort. Even that is highly questionable.
Going undercover to eventually blow the whistle could be doable, I guess. I seem to remember reading in a criminology text that there’s actually career snitches that do basically that in hopes of a reward. Which seems crazy, but whatever.
It’s not really what I think OP was thinking of, though.
I’ve hears animal rights activists will get a job in a slaughter house to blow the whistle.
The closest we’ve had it a green hatted man
Bruce Wayne would have reduced city crime way faster by building affordable housing, and tending to the basic needs of the homeless and the disadvantaged using only the extra profit margins of his wealth.
But he literally does. The problem is that Gotham is literally fucking cursed in a way that makes people aggressive and evil. And like, I don’t think that kinda stuff would stop the Joker from bombing orphanages, or Black Mask/Penguin from running protection rackets, or stop Killer Croc from literally eating people, or stop Nigma from putting people in actual Saw traps…
Like, a good portion of Batman’s rogue gallery are people that the police CANNOT deal with. Hell, I would argue that even an entire counter-terrorism unit couldn’t deal with the bullshit the Batman rogues pull in a weekly basis.
EDIT: Oh yeah, let’s not forget half of the police in Gotham (if not ALL OF IT) is corrupt and is getting bought by those SAME rogues.
Gordon is often the only one presented as untouched by mob money. Usually a few other younger, newer recruits that are too green to get a piece of the spoils.
Commissioner Gordon is the only good cop. I respect him more than any other Batman character, even Bats himself.
Commissioner Gordon is the only good cop.
This is Montoya slander.
The last movie touches on this in that there is a Wayne fund for this improving socioeconomic conditions, but every politician and mafia member has their fingers in it. Good shit. Could’ve cut the length by a good 40 minutes or so
I’m ex-police (did 13 years - UK).
In 13 years of active patrol, (if you’re not counting stopping someone suspicious, searching them and finding some drugs/weapon) I probably stumbled on a crime in progress maybe two or three times. Only one of those was what you’d call serious and that was a kid threatening another kid with a knife as i happened to walk round the corner.
And a couple of shop lifters whilst I was in the security office having a cup of tea with the shop manager.
The hardest part about being a vigilante is actually finding the crime in the first place.
The second hardest part would be actually detaining them without any real authority. The knife lad dropped the knife immediately when I shouted at him. As a masked vigilante you wouldn’t have that authority. You don’t have any backup or anyone to call. And you dont have anywhere to take your captured criminal once you’ve detained them.
Assuming UK cops aren’t as utterly as untrustworthy as north american cops, (which you probably are purely because you don’t always bring around a gun), what are you meant to do with a knife attack? Wack people with a stick? Run away and called for armed backup? I assume the latter, but what about in the immediate?
Carry out a “dynamic risk assessment”.
For me i relied on shock, awe and the fact I was twice this lad’s size.
But yes, metal stick/CS gas were options as well.
What do you do now?
Infosec and compliamce/governance now. Left the police over 10 years ago
Someone with that username enforcing compliance is kinda scary.
It’s nice to see a (former) cop getting to talk without everyone spamming ACAB. That doesn’t actually help anything.
It happens, and they aren’t as impactful as they are represented in movies, TV, and comics.
I first learned about this phenomenon when Phoenix Jones was arrested for using pepper spray to break up a street fight. That’s when I learned that there are a handful of people all over the world that don a mask to confront crime. There’s a list on Wikipedia.
Allow me to introduce you to Phoenix Jones
I laughed so hard when I found out about him selling MDMA
This deserves a post of its own
They’d last a month, tops. They would be ratted out by someone who knows them, probably a coworker.
Ask Phoenix Jones. He did exactly that for three years, although he never actually tried to conceal his identity. He retired from superheroing to be an MMA fighter.
unless they have powers, they will end like luigi, weeks or months. unless you are cognizant enough to hit a different area/person every time.
Luigi continued to wear the same, or very similar, clothes long after the shooting. Batman doesn’t wear his costume when off duty. Also Luigi’s phone gave the cops all sorts of evidence. TheHatedOne on Youtube has a video on this.
None of that came close to bringing him down, though - it was normal clothing and I don’t think anything he did with his phone would have given him away in advance of being captured.
The thing that really did it was his distinctive eyebrows being all over the news. A bit of basic disguise work would be smart if you want to do that kind of thing and get away with it. And probably don’t target a random health insurance bureaucrat.
Pre-19th century: would literally make out like a bandit, assuming they knew how to fight & had supernatural powers
20th century: would make out like gangbusters until the invention and widespread use of CCTV
21st century: without active electronic/optics countermeasures, it’s all over, anonymity of secret identity impossible to keep
Same scenario goes for villains, who were previously able to simply outrun/outwit pursuit by authorities, often within the same country. Wire services made this more difficult, depending on the pursuers in question, then moreso with radio, then moreso with telephony & TV broadcasts, then moreso with the advent of the internet. Current tech can analyze recording of subjects and lift face shots, as well as highly specific information like gait (now sometimes touted in the same way as debunked “bite mark analysis” circa the 1980’s courts/justice system). A hoodie would be workable only under the loosest conditions, the second that anyone pulled off the hood, or the subject in question were photographed both with/without it on, it’s all over.
21st century: without active electronic/optics countermeasures, it’s all over, anonymity of secret identity impossible to keep
What?!
-
Mask on.
-
No cell phone.
-
Uncomfortable shoes to throw off gait recognition.
-
Changing into it after you leave home, changing out of it before you go back. No car, no Uber, no public transport.
It’s literally that easy.
Unless you’re killing oligarchs, they wouldn’t catch you for anything else if taking those precautions.
You don’t need to block every camera, just be unrecognizable when on camera, and have a place to lose the camera and change identities.
Describe for me how far from a city center or incident you think that you would have to travel - minus the car/uber/taxi/bus/train. 5, 10, 15, 20+ miles until zero cameras and a Superman telephone booth costume change?
-
Allow me to introduce you all to Angle Grinder Man.
Fighting street crime is tough, hard to find and it leaves little evidence. White collar crime OTH often leaves a paper trail. They don’t wear capes, but investigative journalists use these paper trails to uncover such crimes.
Yeah, Bellingcat is the closest thing to a real Batman.
Depends entirely on how successful the media wanted him to be. He could be a just, moral and enlightened force for good, but if the he wasn’t dancing to the tune of certain corporations the public could very easily be made to hate him.
Not much if the guy isn’t bullet proof, any weapon would kill him, surely it won’t be like movies where heroes dodge bullets all the time.
Slightly off topic but I often wondered why people who want to commit suicide don’t start a fight against organized crime or some other nasty opponent.
I just don’t think you’d make up to the C Suite offices to do any good. Best you could do is maybe tackle a jaywalker.
I’m fairly certain it would only be a matter of time before someone put a bullet in your head. Charging headlong into criminal violence, tends to get you what you’re asking for.
