It’s just as much a left-wing echo chamber as Truth Social is a right-wing one - and that’s a problem in both cases. Some might say it’s fine because we’re on the right side of history and they’re not, or something along those lines - but the people on Truth Social think the exact same thing. No one’s views ever change that way.
The right wing instances are just defederated from this larger federated group because the people on them were unable to follow the rules of other instances. Repeatedly, they would throw tantrums and create loads of dupe accounts to spam shit when people downvoted their shitty views or their accounts got banned. If they were capable of behaving with civility and following the rules, they’d still be here.
No idea how active that corner of the Lemmyverse is these days, but they have repeatedly chosen to behave in a way that leaves instance administrators with little choice other than defederation.
There is also a dearth of cannibalistic viewpoints here. And Zoroastrians are woefully underrepresented.
I don’t come here to change my views (though it happens from time to time), and neither do they. I’m not ignorant of their thoughts; I’m inundated with them every day. I don’t need to interact with assholes here. I don’t want to come here and watch people scream back and forth at each other, and I definitely am not interested in participating—there is a reason I’ve left other social media.
You don’t have to subscribe to political communities if you don’t want to see political discussion. But the dearth of genuine political discussion here is a problem for the people who do want it, that can’t be fixed by individual action.
You don’t have to subscribe to political communities if you don’t want to see political discussion.
True but it seems like the majority of Lemmys like attaching anything and everything to something political. I saw some post about a squirrel or something, just chiling in the heat. Supposed to be cute. Immediately devolved into how fat the squirrel looked and how it must be a MAGA squirrel. Then the conversation just devolved into “cheeto man”(stupidist overused Lemmy term ever!) jokes over and over.
Also, Lemmy: why the fuck do you all think saying “cheeto man” is so hilarious? It’s something that 2nd graders would snicker at. Once. And you all say it over and over. WTF?! No wonder you all can’t get girlfriends.
Yeah this is something that has got way worse over time. It used to be that most forums would default to “no politics” and then there were discussion areas set aside for that. And now if you criticise someone for bringing politics into something where it doesn’t belong, you will get angry responses declaring that you’re burying your head in the sand. No, I just don’t want lowest-hanging-fruit political comments on every cat picture.
But the dearth of genuine political discussion here is a problem for the people who do want it
It’s not genuine if we don’t want to constantly have to expose ourselves to toxic bigots or “smooth” manipulators who think it’s not really toxic bigotry if they are “just asking questions?”
It’s not genuine if we don’t want to start every single discussion of something bad Trump did with rebutting a half dozen versions of “but whatabout that time when dems…”?
I’ve said it before and I’ll say it again:
I will not be shamed into allowing toxicity into my life, on social media or otherwise, in the name of “avoiding an echo chamber.” NOTHING is stopping a conservative from coming here and making cogent, factual arguments, aside from their own fragility.
The conservatives who “can’t” post to Lemmy are the ones who don’t know how to have an actual conversation and get banned. What fraction of conservatives that represents is an excercise left to the reader. But I’ve got my own opinion on that number for sure.
NOTHING is stopping a conservative from coming here and making cogent, factual arguments, aside from their own fragility.
Except for all the Lemmys saying that no conservatives should be allowed on Lemmy. I have seen conservatives try to ask a question. Then so many immediately jump to calling the poster a sealioning nazi, that they just get run off. Lemmy is one of the more hateful places I have seen.
I’m not conservative by the way, so you all don’t have send me nazi dm’s.
I don’t think there is such a thing as a left wing echo chamber. We bicker incessantly. The other day I was making a joke at the expense of the car-brain mentality and someone came at me for ableism.
I’m not mad at them, it’s just illustrative of my point. We don’t take shit from each other, and we take each other to task over jokes. The right will, meanwhile, forgive literal pedophilia, rape, and murder of each other. I’m sure as hell not saying we should, but we will never create an echo chamber as good as they do because of that.
Yes, and just like Trump, I’m not speaking of the white nationalists and nazies.
"So you know what, it’s fine. You’re changing history. You’re changing culture. And you had people – and I’m not talking about the neo-Nazis and the white nationalists – because they should be condemned totally. But you had many people in that group other than neo-Nazis and white nationalists. Okay? And the press has treated them absolutely unfairly.
“Now, in the other group also, you had some fine people. But you also had troublemakers, and you see them come with the black outfits and with the helmets, and with the baseball bats. You had a lot of bad people in the other group.”
Note that this is the second statement he made, which he had to make after being called out by the media for seemingly supporting the neonazi protestors. Which, given his history at that point and subsequently, it’s pretty obvious that the media was right and he was just back tracking due to bad publicity.
Yeah, and it specifically ignores that the statement you posted was the second, clarifying statement days later. Snopes is going off what he said he meant, not actually what he said. Check the United the Right wiki page for the actual timeline.
Stop letting other people think for you.
Trump did not respond to the torchlight parade on Friday night or the demonstrations on Saturday morning until 1:19 pm on Saturday, August 12, when he tweeted, “We ALL must be united & condemn all that hate stands for. There is no place for this kind of violence in America. Lets come together as one!”[284][33]
At the bill-signing ceremony, Trump said that “we condemn in the strongest possible terms this egregious display of hatred, bigotry and violence on many sides, on many sides”.[284][33][288][289] He added that it had been “going on for a long time in our country. Not Donald Trump, not Barack Obama. A long, long time” and that “a swift restoration of law and order” was now vital.[289]
A statement attributed to an unnamed White House spokesperson was released the next day, asserting that "The President said very strongly in his statement yesterday that he condemns all forms of violence, bigotry, and hatred. Of course that includes white supremacists, KKK, Neo-Nazi and all extremist groups. He called for national unity and bringing all Americans together
…
After the backlash for his remarks, Trump read a statement from a teleprompter two days later at the White House.[310][292] He said that “anyone who acted criminally in this weekend’s racist violence, you will be held fully accountable.”[287] and that “[r]acism is evil. And those who cause violence in its name are criminals and thugs, including the K.K.K., neo-Nazis, white supremacists and other hate groups that are repugnant to everything we hold dear as Americans.”[311]
The closest they have is the unattributed statement, again after the fact, trying to clarify what he said wasn’t what he meant. Like they always do.
But it’s this very specific quote that people are misrepresenting. It’s not like he first said “there were fine people on both sides” and then, a few days later, clarified that he wasn’t talking about the Nazis. He said there were fine people on both sides and explicitly added that he was not referring to the Nazis - and it’s that latter part people omit when they spread the “fine people on both sides” quote.
Uh huh, and I’m sure we can take him at his word. It’s not like he’s ever lied. He never gave a nod to nazis ever, like telling the proud boys to stand by. Yup, good old not racist donnie, I’m sure he totally hates white supremacists.
You wanna talk bad faith, believe anything that comes out of his orange piehole.
Misrepresenting what someone says is a textbook example of bad faith so doing that in a discussion about bad faith is ironic to say the least. What he actually thinks is unrelated to this discussion as it’s about what he said. You’d call people out for twisting your words so hold yourself to the same standards.
You are appearing more and more bad faith, or just plain grossly ignorant, and willfully so… If you won’t accept the truth, the truth that is being handed to you, with references, by other people, then prepare to not be part of this “echo chamber” for much longer…
Not believing lying sociopaths is not bad faith, and I’m having trouble accepting that you’d actually think it is. I’m not sure why you’re so hung up on mango mussolini anyway, as this discussion started when I claimed that the right lied way more than the left. The president wasn’t responsible for all the lies the GOP has told for the past 50 years, although he sure does have more than his fair share.
You’re misquoting him - that’s bad faith. Whether or not you believe him is a separate issue. When you criticize someone for what they said, you should address their actual words - not your interpretation of them.
I think the main problem is that there isn’t much besides politics and memes. Most communities that aren’t politics seem to devolve into meme communities.
The real mystery to me is what value the echo-chamber residents get out of it. Why would someone join a group of people they already agree with, just to be told that their opinions are correct, and to shout down any interloper who contradict them? How is that not a boring waste of time? Is it that most people are insecure in their views and need validation, perhaps? It’s a phenomenon I still don’t understand.
People often accuse me of being a troll because I tend to voice views that are unpopular on this platform. Personally, I just don’t see any point in talking about things we all already agree on. I’d much rather try to change the views of those I disagree with - or have them try to change mine.
I’d much, much rather be in an echo chamber where BS is questioned and reality is not ignored than a conservative hellscape where basic facts of reality are ignored, like, “tons of CO2 in the atmosphere is totally fine, actually” or, “trans people are corrupting sports!”.
Yea… fuck those at best extremely stupid people and at worst, vitriolic piles of trash.
Some might say it’s fine because we’re on the right side of history and they’re not, or something along those lines
I say it’s fine because if there’s one thing I’ve learned repeatedly since about 2017, it’s that the single most effective thing I can do to reduce toxicity in my life is to reduce my interactions with conservative family members, coworkers, ‘friends’, and social media accounts.
It’s remarkably effective. I interact with no conservative or known trump voter more than work or family obligations require. Haven’t for years. Best mental health step I’ve taken in my adult life.
Not my fault they have all forgotten that “loudest asshole in the room” isn’t a personality.
It’s just as much a left-wing echo chamber as Truth Social is a right-wing one - and that’s a problem in both cases. Some might say it’s fine because we’re on the right side of history and they’re not, or something along those lines - but the people on Truth Social think the exact same thing. No one’s views ever change that way.
The right wing instances are just defederated from this larger federated group because the people on them were unable to follow the rules of other instances. Repeatedly, they would throw tantrums and create loads of dupe accounts to spam shit when people downvoted their shitty views or their accounts got banned. If they were capable of behaving with civility and following the rules, they’d still be here.
No idea how active that corner of the Lemmyverse is these days, but they have repeatedly chosen to behave in a way that leaves instance administrators with little choice other than defederation.
There is also a dearth of cannibalistic viewpoints here. And Zoroastrians are woefully underrepresented.
I don’t come here to change my views (though it happens from time to time), and neither do they. I’m not ignorant of their thoughts; I’m inundated with them every day. I don’t need to interact with assholes here. I don’t want to come here and watch people scream back and forth at each other, and I definitely am not interested in participating—there is a reason I’ve left other social media.
You don’t have to subscribe to political communities if you don’t want to see political discussion. But the dearth of genuine political discussion here is a problem for the people who do want it, that can’t be fixed by individual action.
True but it seems like the majority of Lemmys like attaching anything and everything to something political. I saw some post about a squirrel or something, just chiling in the heat. Supposed to be cute. Immediately devolved into how fat the squirrel looked and how it must be a MAGA squirrel. Then the conversation just devolved into “cheeto man”(stupidist overused Lemmy term ever!) jokes over and over.
Also, Lemmy: why the fuck do you all think saying “cheeto man” is so hilarious? It’s something that 2nd graders would snicker at. Once. And you all say it over and over. WTF?! No wonder you all can’t get girlfriends.
Yeah this is something that has got way worse over time. It used to be that most forums would default to “no politics” and then there were discussion areas set aside for that. And now if you criticise someone for bringing politics into something where it doesn’t belong, you will get angry responses declaring that you’re burying your head in the sand. No, I just don’t want lowest-hanging-fruit political comments on every cat picture.
It’s not genuine if we don’t want to constantly have to expose ourselves to toxic bigots or “smooth” manipulators who think it’s not really toxic bigotry if they are “just asking questions?”
It’s not genuine if we don’t want to start every single discussion of something bad Trump did with rebutting a half dozen versions of “but whatabout that time when dems…”?
I’ve said it before and I’ll say it again:
I will not be shamed into allowing toxicity into my life, on social media or otherwise, in the name of “avoiding an echo chamber.” NOTHING is stopping a conservative from coming here and making cogent, factual arguments, aside from their own fragility.
The conservatives who “can’t” post to Lemmy are the ones who don’t know how to have an actual conversation and get banned. What fraction of conservatives that represents is an excercise left to the reader. But I’ve got my own opinion on that number for sure.
Except for all the Lemmys saying that no conservatives should be allowed on Lemmy. I have seen conservatives try to ask a question. Then so many immediately jump to calling the poster a sealioning nazi, that they just get run off. Lemmy is one of the more hateful places I have seen.
I’m not conservative by the way, so you all don’t have send me nazi dm’s.
I don’t think there is such a thing as a left wing echo chamber. We bicker incessantly. The other day I was making a joke at the expense of the car-brain mentality and someone came at me for ableism.
I’m not mad at them, it’s just illustrative of my point. We don’t take shit from each other, and we take each other to task over jokes. The right will, meanwhile, forgive literal pedophilia, rape, and murder of each other. I’m sure as hell not saying we should, but we will never create an echo chamber as good as they do because of that.
The problem is the right no longer argue their points in good faith.
“The right” consists of individuals, just like “the left” does - and there’s plenty of bad faith to be found on both sides.
Is this like plenty of fine people on both sides? In aggregate, one side is far more egregious and it’s not even close.
Speaking of bad faith…
Yes, and just like Trump, I’m not speaking of the white nationalists and nazies.
Source
Note that this is the second statement he made, which he had to make after being called out by the media for seemingly supporting the neonazi protestors. Which, given his history at that point and subsequently, it’s pretty obvious that the media was right and he was just back tracking due to bad publicity.
This is where the “fine people on both sides” quote originates from.
Snopes article on the matter.
Yeah, and it specifically ignores that the statement you posted was the second, clarifying statement days later. Snopes is going off what he said he meant, not actually what he said. Check the United the Right wiki page for the actual timeline.
Stop letting other people think for you.
…
The closest they have is the unattributed statement, again after the fact, trying to clarify what he said wasn’t what he meant. Like they always do.
But it’s this very specific quote that people are misrepresenting. It’s not like he first said “there were fine people on both sides” and then, a few days later, clarified that he wasn’t talking about the Nazis. He said there were fine people on both sides and explicitly added that he was not referring to the Nazis - and it’s that latter part people omit when they spread the “fine people on both sides” quote.
Uh huh, and I’m sure we can take him at his word. It’s not like he’s ever lied. He never gave a nod to nazis ever, like telling the proud boys to stand by. Yup, good old not racist donnie, I’m sure he totally hates white supremacists.
You wanna talk bad faith, believe anything that comes out of his orange piehole.
Misrepresenting what someone says is a textbook example of bad faith so doing that in a discussion about bad faith is ironic to say the least. What he actually thinks is unrelated to this discussion as it’s about what he said. You’d call people out for twisting your words so hold yourself to the same standards.
You are appearing more and more bad faith, or just plain grossly ignorant, and willfully so… If you won’t accept the truth, the truth that is being handed to you, with references, by other people, then prepare to not be part of this “echo chamber” for much longer…
I don’t consider anything I’ve heard so far to be the kind of evidence that would indicate what I said is somehow false.
Not believing lying sociopaths is not bad faith, and I’m having trouble accepting that you’d actually think it is. I’m not sure why you’re so hung up on mango mussolini anyway, as this discussion started when I claimed that the right lied way more than the left. The president wasn’t responsible for all the lies the GOP has told for the past 50 years, although he sure does have more than his fair share.
You’re misquoting him - that’s bad faith. Whether or not you believe him is a separate issue. When you criticize someone for what they said, you should address their actual words - not your interpretation of them.
I think the main problem is that there isn’t much besides politics and memes. Most communities that aren’t politics seem to devolve into meme communities.
I feel like that’s an issue that’s exacerbated by the predominance of image posts over text posts, and text post only communities.
Agreed on all counts.
The real mystery to me is what value the echo-chamber residents get out of it. Why would someone join a group of people they already agree with, just to be told that their opinions are correct, and to shout down any interloper who contradict them? How is that not a boring waste of time? Is it that most people are insecure in their views and need validation, perhaps? It’s a phenomenon I still don’t understand.
People often accuse me of being a troll because I tend to voice views that are unpopular on this platform. Personally, I just don’t see any point in talking about things we all already agree on. I’d much rather try to change the views of those I disagree with - or have them try to change mine.
This exactly where I am on all counts. Stick with it!
I’d much, much rather be in an echo chamber where BS is questioned and reality is not ignored than a conservative hellscape where basic facts of reality are ignored, like, “tons of CO2 in the atmosphere is totally fine, actually” or, “trans people are corrupting sports!”.
Yea… fuck those at best extremely stupid people and at worst, vitriolic piles of trash.
I say it’s fine because if there’s one thing I’ve learned repeatedly since about 2017, it’s that the single most effective thing I can do to reduce toxicity in my life is to reduce my interactions with conservative family members, coworkers, ‘friends’, and social media accounts.
It’s remarkably effective. I interact with no conservative or known trump voter more than work or family obligations require. Haven’t for years. Best mental health step I’ve taken in my adult life.
Not my fault they have all forgotten that “loudest asshole in the room” isn’t a personality.
would you like to tell me which political side is currently putting people in concentration camps and starting a war