Mexico’s first openly non-binary magistrate and prominent LGBTQ activist Jesús Ociel Baena Saucedo was found dead at home in the central state of Aguascalientes on Monday.
Another article specified that they were literally found stabbed to death. How the fuck is there not foul play involved? Sounds like the AG is in on it or at least permissive of anti-LGBTQ+ violence.
Would that really suprise you coming from Mexico?
Like good on the people to elect them, and respect for being them for open about who they are, but the country has some serious issues and this isn’t near the top of the list unfortunately.
You say that like they didnt legalize gay marriage, elect LGBTQ allies, strengthen and protect abortion laws in response to the roe vs wade overturner, and legalize pot. And that’s just to name a few.
Oh and you don’t lose your house if you have to go to the hospital without insurance.
Say what you will about Mexico, but in some aspects it’s more advanced than United States. At least when it comes to the red states.
Would that really suprise you coming from Mexico?
Like good on the people to elect them, and respect for being them for open about who they are, but the country has some serious issues and this isn’t near the top of the list unfortunately.
What exactly did you mean by this? Because it sure reads like you’re saying “Mexico is unfriendly towards LGBTQ+”, because you think this shouldn’t be surprising “coming from Mexico”.
There is evidence for a counterpoint to this implied statement: that Mexico is not unfriendly to LGBTQ+, but your response to that evidence was “I didn’t say they didn’t (enact legal protections, etc etc), don’t put words in my mouth”, so what exactly did you mean by what I quoted from you?
In a country that has a high amount of politically motivated violence, an elected official (especially one that would be progressive) being killed isn’t really a surprise to me.
Legal protections does not equal a friendly attitude. As I have experienced in my country (as we have had legal same sex marriage since 2005, and being allowed to serve in the CAF since 1992 as LGBTQIA+ individuals and being the second country legalise pot nationwide, second to Uruguay).
We still get warnings about kidnapping and cartel violence when we book trips to resorts there (among all the other warnings like the water isn’t exactly safe).
So yeah, a memeber of my community being murdered while in a position of power in Mexico isn’t that big of a surprise. My initial thoughts was this was cartel violence. And apparently one of the AGs in the region demonstrated a lack of empathy or corruption in thier initial statement. But it could be violence against them for being NB.
Right, so, you do mean “violence against LGBTQ+ people is unsurprising from Mexico”; so the other poster wasn’t putting words in your mouth, they correctly interpreted your meaning.
What they said was
you say that like they haven’t [passed all these progressive laws]
You gave a very valid and pithy response here:
Legal protections does not equal a friendly attitude.
Legalization would bring in more government meddling, not less. Exactly as you said, the government doesn’t have that much power. Cartels currently have full control of production, distribution and profits. They do not want regulations, taxes and dealing with competition in uhh… less confrontational ways. That’s even if they’d be allowed into the market, which is unlikely.
Living in a red state, I would? It’s not every year that an elected official gets whacked, even one that’s a member of a hated minority. For reference, there’s been 57 assassinated government officials in the US total: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_assassinated_American_politicians
Saying “Eh this is just par for the course all countries are like this” feels like it minimalizes the problem.
“Not every decade” is maybe a poor choice of words given your supplied evidence. Though technically it does look like 2 decades were skipped… but a handful of decades had more than 5 to make up for those skipped decades.
“Not every year” would at least be a much more defensible statement given your provided context.
That might be due to our heavy government surveillance system. Remember, it wasn’t that long ago that a militia was arrested before they could carry out their plan to kidnap the governor of Michigan. The year before that a Coast Guard lieutenant was arrested before he could kill journalists and Democrat politicians. There was that nutjob who took a hammer to Pelosi’s husband’s head (Didn’t even catch that one in time!) There’s tons of attempts to assassinate presidents. Kinda feels pretty par for the course.
But the original point, I think, was that it’s kinda weird for someone to say it’s not surprising for it to happen in Mexico, as if it’s some third world country run like New York in Escape from New York while pretending it doesn’t happen in the US frequently. The US is just a bigger police state so they catch most of them before anyone dies. The FBI has plants in militias and groups like them all over the country specifically to catch this kind of thing. Most governments just can’t afford that kind of manpower. The US is not special or really that much safer, and comments normalizing this kind of thing for Mexico is why anyone even made that argument. It’s definitely shitty, and probably racist to think that it’s reasonable, when it’s in Mexico, people say "Eh it happens.”
In general, or just in red states? Cross-referencing LGBT politicians with their states’ historical political leanings, an openly LGBT politician has been elected or reelected while their state was considered republican a total of 96 times. The lead is actually a three-way split between Florida, Georgia, and Arizona, each with a total of 9.
So. Less than it perhaps should. Way more than you’d think.
Another article specified that they were literally found stabbed to death. How the fuck is there not foul play involved? Sounds like the AG is in on it or at least permissive of anti-LGBTQ+ violence.
Would that really suprise you coming from Mexico? Like good on the people to elect them, and respect for being them for open about who they are, but the country has some serious issues and this isn’t near the top of the list unfortunately.
You say that like they didnt legalize gay marriage, elect LGBTQ allies, strengthen and protect abortion laws in response to the roe vs wade overturner, and legalize pot. And that’s just to name a few.
Oh and you don’t lose your house if you have to go to the hospital without insurance.
Say what you will about Mexico, but in some aspects it’s more advanced than United States. At least when it comes to the red states.
I didn’t say anything like that in my statement. I also didn’t imply anything like that in my statement.
Don’t put words into people’s mouths.
Honey, you don’t need to outright say something for the implications and subtext to be there.
And sometimes there isn’t subtext. Or you just absolutely miss the fucking point.
What exactly did you mean by this? Because it sure reads like you’re saying “Mexico is unfriendly towards LGBTQ+”, because you think this shouldn’t be surprising “coming from Mexico”.
There is evidence for a counterpoint to this implied statement: that Mexico is not unfriendly to LGBTQ+, but your response to that evidence was “I didn’t say they didn’t (enact legal protections, etc etc), don’t put words in my mouth”, so what exactly did you mean by what I quoted from you?
In a country that has a high amount of politically motivated violence, an elected official (especially one that would be progressive) being killed isn’t really a surprise to me.
Legal protections does not equal a friendly attitude. As I have experienced in my country (as we have had legal same sex marriage since 2005, and being allowed to serve in the CAF since 1992 as LGBTQIA+ individuals and being the second country legalise pot nationwide, second to Uruguay).
We still get warnings about kidnapping and cartel violence when we book trips to resorts there (among all the other warnings like the water isn’t exactly safe).
So yeah, a memeber of my community being murdered while in a position of power in Mexico isn’t that big of a surprise. My initial thoughts was this was cartel violence. And apparently one of the AGs in the region demonstrated a lack of empathy or corruption in thier initial statement. But it could be violence against them for being NB.
So yeah, sad but not a shock.
Right, so, you do mean “violence against LGBTQ+ people is unsurprising from Mexico”; so the other poster wasn’t putting words in your mouth, they correctly interpreted your meaning.
What they said was
You gave a very valid and pithy response here:
Glad we could clear that up! 😊
Legalising pot is probably just a concession to the narcos
It’s fentanyl now. Pot is cheap and easy to grow in Mexico.
Yeah, but cartels can still produce it
lol there is no way Narcos want legalized drugs. Not that weed makes up any significant percentage of their business.
Why wouldn’t they want to sell a secondary product without any government meddling (not that the government has that much power lol)
Legalization would bring in more government meddling, not less. Exactly as you said, the government doesn’t have that much power. Cartels currently have full control of production, distribution and profits. They do not want regulations, taxes and dealing with competition in uhh… less confrontational ways. That’s even if they’d be allowed into the market, which is unlikely.
Legalisation means the government won’t even bother to pretend to fight cannabis trade
No it doesn’t. Speaking from Canadian experience, legalization was a crackdown on the wild west of dispensaries we had here.
… that’s not going that works.
While it isn’t surprising in Mexico, it is also not surprising from any other country either. Not sure what’s the point of singling it out.
Yeah honestly if something like this happened in one of the redder states in the US I would not be remotely surprised.
Living in a red state, I would? It’s not every year that an elected official gets whacked, even one that’s a member of a hated minority. For reference, there’s been 57 assassinated government officials in the US total: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_assassinated_American_politicians
Saying “Eh this is just par for the course all countries are like this” feels like it minimalizes the problem.
“Not every decade” is maybe a poor choice of words given your supplied evidence. Though technically it does look like 2 decades were skipped… but a handful of decades had more than 5 to make up for those skipped decades.
“Not every year” would at least be a much more defensible statement given your provided context.
Yeah, that’s fair. FWIW it’s still uncommon enough that “Eh it happens” isn’t reasonable.
That might be due to our heavy government surveillance system. Remember, it wasn’t that long ago that a militia was arrested before they could carry out their plan to kidnap the governor of Michigan. The year before that a Coast Guard lieutenant was arrested before he could kill journalists and Democrat politicians. There was that nutjob who took a hammer to Pelosi’s husband’s head (Didn’t even catch that one in time!) There’s tons of attempts to assassinate presidents. Kinda feels pretty par for the course.
But the original point, I think, was that it’s kinda weird for someone to say it’s not surprising for it to happen in Mexico, as if it’s some third world country run like New York in Escape from New York while pretending it doesn’t happen in the US frequently. The US is just a bigger police state so they catch most of them before anyone dies. The FBI has plants in militias and groups like them all over the country specifically to catch this kind of thing. Most governments just can’t afford that kind of manpower. The US is not special or really that much safer, and comments normalizing this kind of thing for Mexico is why anyone even made that argument. It’s definitely shitty, and probably racist to think that it’s reasonable, when it’s in Mexico, people say "Eh it happens.”
What? This would be pretty damn surprising, please don’t fight ignorance with more ignorance, it’s not a good look
Pretty damn surprising to you maybe. I’m speaking for myself.
It would be surprising they were stabbed not shot?
I would be surprised they would elect a LGBTQ+ friendly politician in the first place
In general, or just in red states? Cross-referencing LGBT politicians with their states’ historical political leanings, an openly LGBT politician has been elected or reelected while their state was considered republican a total of 96 times. The lead is actually a three-way split between Florida, Georgia, and Arizona, each with a total of 9.
So. Less than it perhaps should. Way more than you’d think.
I would be surprised they were stabbed rather than shot. US conservatives are too cowardly for a knife fight.
Pretty sure asassination of politicians is up there with the rrst of serious stuff that thr country has problems with, what kind of take is yours?
It was presided over by an impartial knife-fight referee.