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1 year agoYeah I shouldn’t have used Vietnam as an example bc I am aware that they’re somehow largely favorable to the US still, but the lasting effects of US imperialism on the population there is what I was really trying to get at.
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Cake day: August 2nd, 2023
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Why don’t we ask South America, the Middle East, and Vietnam what they think about the US?
but it’s clear which is the better option for many
… American tax dollars are at this moment funding the genocide of Palestinians.
EDIT to add: I should clarify I’m no CCP apologist, nor do I uplift China as an example of what we should strive for. But I also really get tired of seeing America put on a pedestal. America was built on genocide, slavery, and exploitation, I don’t see how it should ever be an example of how to do things better, BECAUSE that line of reasoning (“at least we’re better than them”) has been used to justify many of the horrors of our history.
By using that bit of propaganda, you’re contributing to things like Americans looking the other way/enabling - for the past 75 years - genocide. It’s the same “they’re savages” shit that was used to justify literally the most savage acts against Native Americans.
Our democracy also isn’t actual democracy. By definition, a democracy must represent the will of the people. Ours does not. It is already a failed democracy, and has been for my entire life. America also produces more propaganda than any other country. Do we have more personal freedoms in many areas than people in China? Absolutely. Are there many areas throughout society where I think America has pushed the world forward and made it a better place? Absolutely.
But I’m getting really sick of seeing America compared to China just to say “we’re better”.
18·1 year agoMeh, an RGB notification LED was still much more glanceable. I agree that it’s somewhat redundant, but I had OLED phones with notif LEDs and it was still nice.
So you’re just talking out your ass and presenting as fact.
I asked for sources for your claim because I couldn’t find a single source saying it was Hamas, while multiple claimed Israel.
I’m the one actually doing research and being responsible about how I discuss this topic. You presented as fact something you couldn’t provide a single source for. I said “there’s reports” and was able to provide a handful of reports when asked.
I’ve read multiple books on the conflict, I know pretty detailed history going back to just prior to 1917. I don’t need a wikipedia article that goes back less than 20 years, thanks.
iF yOu CaN, aLSo rEaD iN diFFeReNT lAnGuAGes
How about if you can, don’t present complete bullshit as fact? For starters, at least. Then maybe you can get on some goofy-ass multilingual high horse 🤦♂️
https://apnews.com/article/israel-palestinians-gaza-hamas-war-c8b4fc20e4fd2ef381d5edb7e9e8308c
https://www.ndtv.com/world-news/israel-bombs-hit-only-exit-route-for-gaza-residents-4469430
And an eyewitness report: https://www.972mag.com/gaza-salah-al-din-road/
I didn’t bother sourcing since this was all easy to find, but happy to provide.
Source? Or is that just a hunch that you’re presenting as fact?
In fact, I’d be wary of saying anything without “reportedly” heavily attached in this kinda situation. There is so much propaganda and misinformation that stating anything as fact is dangerous.
There’s reports of them bombing the exit corridor.
1·1 year agoAh I see, ty
If you’re on Android why not just use revanced or Newpipe? Both are excellent and I haven’t had issues with revanced since this change.
everyone else is a hateful ass
Nope, just you actually.
you are the only one who understands Israel / Palestine
Nope, lots of people (who have actually educated themselves) understand it. You just let your bigotry get in the way of doing so.
and … what? kick Israel out of the middle east?
Ending the apartheid of Palestinians is necessary before anything else. That is what my comments have focused on this entire discussion, aside from cleaning up the vomit of misinformation you insist on spewing. Anything past ending apartheid is part of a process that would need to involve all people currently living in Palestine/Israel, and would almost certainly involve some kind of intermediary party.
I don’t think I’ve heard your solution.
That’s because it’s not my place to offer that, and me suggesting a solution would be meaningless. I do think it would probably have to involve either a 2-state solution where Palestine is given assistance to rebuild, or a carefully constructed single state where the rights of all citizens are protected. But again, that’s just like “yeah I think these are probably the most likely general ways that peace could be found there”, I’m not making suggestions or even saying those are the most likely, I just think they may be based on my understanding of things.
I’m just trying to help inform and to combat blind hatred, misinformation, and bigotry spewed by you. That’s it.
TO summarize: When they had power and they chose to make a 2 tiered society: that was long ago - they can’t be blamed for that.
When Palestine thought they had enough power to get rid of Israel, and they tried to do it in a war they lost - they can’t be blamed for that. Those were ‘colonizers’ they were trying to kill.
When they elected Hamas and attacked Israel, they can’t be blamed for that because they were frustrated at their lack of power.
Yup, pretty much.
To summarize (without trying to paint Palestinians as evil brown people):
- Over 95% of the casualties of this conflict have been Palestinian
- Palestinians have lived in an Apartheid state, been denied food, water, electricity, and bombed with the most advanced arsenal on earth for 80 years… in one of the most densely populated areas on earth
- Israel has enjoyed the full financial and military backing of the US and commits war crimes daily against the Palestinian people
- Your dumb ass thinks that somehow Palestinians deserve this shit because you’re quite literally racist. (every single comment you’ve made has had racist remarks which I have identified clearly)
- You wanna pretend to care about women’s rights despite not actually giving a single fuck about Palestinian women
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
>Can’t point to a single double standard of mine, just has to pretend like it’s laughable
Keep trying. I enjoy seeing bigots squirm.
They elected Hamas
The last election was 2006, was obstructed by Israel, and while Hamas won, they only had 44% of the vote. It’s also not surprising that Palestinians would vote for the group they thought had the best chance of standing up to Israel, even if they may disagree with Hamas otherwise.
So even in the midst of horrific oppression, a majority of Palestinians DID NOT vote for Hamas, despite their oppression at the hands of the Israeli govt. To me that says a WHOLE LOTTA “not everyone agrees with Hamas”.
Source for your racist ass since you said more racist BS without a source and can’t be assed to look up basic details when ur racism and blind hatred of religion is involved (bigot).
Show me the government of Palestine that doesn’t
There isn’t a proper government of Palestine because of Israeli oppression, numbskull.
People like you easily blame all Americans for the actions of american government
Nope, try again. EVERY SINGLE COMMENT you try to put words in my mouth and associate me with ideas I do not agree with. Your argument is so fucking idiotic that you have to resort to that to have a reply other than “yakno ur right, my hate for religion is blinding me to human rights and causing me to say racist things, and I need to go educate my ignorant ass before continuing to speak”.
Why would you even think that’d be something I say when I so clearly do the opposite when discussing other countries? Why would it make sense for me to lump 400million people, spread across a vast geographic area, with differing histories, local issues, religions, ways of life, etc. together? What thought process led you to such a stupid fucking claim?
Also, unlike you, I haven’t displayed a tendency to hold double standards. You’ve been the one lumping countries and people groups together this entire conversation, but now you wanna get upset that you think I lump everyone in a country together? Talk about COGNITIVE DISSONANCE.
But you want zero responsibility for Palestinians for Palestinians government.
Quote me where I said that, straw man. (that’s ur name from now on, since you can only argue against strawman arguments)
Ur a fuckin racist, which has been demonstrated in every single comment of yours. You ignore most of my arguments because you have no response. Your responses are filled with strawman arguments, ignoring facts, false equivalencies, and unhinged hatred of religion which clouds your ability to think critically or be empathetic towards people who are being oppressed and suffering human rights abuses. Get over yourself, self-righteous bigot.
Take the fucking L and stop embarrassing yourself. It’s really painful tbh watching you humiliate yourself like this. You got a humiliation fetish or something?
The cognitive dissonance is truly staggering.
but violence against jews pre-Israel was fine
Yet again putting words in my mouth. No, the violence pre-Israel wasn’t fine. But it wasn’t the oppression and attempted genocide of an indigenous people.
but Palestinians are justified in hanging on to land ownership rights from the times of their great-great-grandparents.
Nobody is alive that would have had a say in any of the shit you brought up.
There are people alive who had a hand in, or were victims of, the Nakba. The distinction really isn’t that hard to make unless you’re just terribly dense or have an agenda.
And I haven’t brought up land rights at all, but land is being actively taken away from Palestinians illegally as part of their ongoing oppression, so yet again you show yourself to be an uneducated idiot who comments on shit they don’t understand.
I’m a ‘hateful atheist’ for pointing out that people who identify as fundamentalist followers of violent ideologies are statistically more likely to kill not only each other
Not at all what you said. You’re a hateful atheist for lumping all Palestinians together with religious extremists, repeatedly, for discussing the entire conflict as if there are only religious fundamentalists involved, for the callous way you discuss religion’s involvement in the conflict, and the way you let it cloud your perception of events so much that you minimize attempted genocide. (Also, coincidentally why I called you a racist. Because characterizing an entire people group by the actions of religious extremists is fucking racist, bigot)
I should do my best to elevate these people
Again with the racism. Can’t go two lines without it. “These people” are not all religious extremists. You can call for the end of the oppression of Palestinians while also calling for a situation that doesn’t put Hamas in power. It’s kinda crazy, you don’t need to let your hate for religion influence how you speak about an entire oppressed people group.
I get that Israel is kicking the shit out of Gaza recently
That’s a real minimalist way to say they’ve been committing genocide for 80 years.
I think you get that if Palestine had all the power, they’d be kicking the shit out of Israel
Yakno for someone who hates on people believing in imaginary shit, you sure like to make up imaginary scenarios to use in arguments a lot. I’m not in lalaland like ur bigoted ass, I’m in the real world where ACTUAL OPPRESSION IS CURRENTLY HAPPENING. That’s what I care about, not saying that the people being oppressed deserve it cause “they’d probably do the same thing” (Racism. That there is racism. Since you have no clue what racism is either, apparently)
Its just that you think that would be justified because you’re a racist/bigot/insert one of your insults here
You have actually made a number of racist/bigoted remarks in your comments. I call out your bigotry/racism for what it is, and have specifically identified things you’ve said that are problematic. It’s not just an insult I throw around, you were just literally being racist, because you’re a bigot. Show me where I’ve said something bigoted or racist.
In fact, the first comment of yours I replied to was some shit I called out, and every comment since has had something that was either outright bigotry or reeked of it.
At this point, there is a clear pattern of bigoted remarks, which takes it from “you’re saying some things that maybe are bigoted” (paraphrasing my first reply to you) to “you’ve made a lot of racist/bigoted remarks, and you refuse to address the problematic nature of your comments while continuing to say the same shit. Therefore, you’re a fucking bigot”.
Religious bullshit never stops.
And bigoted idiots never stop spewing bullshit.
I got an impossible challenge for ur response:
-
No pearl-clutching (“tHeY’D dEstrOY mY Way oF LifE”-type shit)
-
No false equivalencies (talk about oppression without an imaginary whataboutism scenario)
-
Talk about victims of oppression without deflecting to ur hatred of religion (and with actual compassion, for added bonus)
For someone who claims to care about women’s rights and protecting ur “way of life” u sure don’t seem to give af if Palestinian women get human rights anytime soon. Fucking hypocrite.
-
So you admit
No. Stop putting words in my mouth. I’ve told you off for that multiple times already.
there’s no single starting point for the conflict if pre-nakba events are taken into account
Not true. pre-Nakba events set the stage for the Nakba, which was the beginning of the nation of Israel, the Apartheid and systemic oppression of Palestinians, and created the conditions for Hamas to rise to power.
but because Israel formed a state to defend itself, they are in the wrong?
No, Israel is in the wrong because the formation of that state included intentionally killing, displacing, and erasing the culture of Palestinians in a process that can be described with stages 0-8 of genocide, headass.
Lol all my comments make it clear I hate zionists.
Not when you’re parroting Zionist rhetoric (see above) and dog whistles in many of your comments.
If neither side were fundamentalist shit heads trying to destroy their neighbors way of life, they wouldn’t have these problems
You paint it as an equal, reciprocal relationship. It’s not. Israel kills many times more people, they began the oppression, Palestinians are currently living under apartheid controlled by Israel.
This is why I say you sound like a Zionist. You continue to deny that Israel is the oppressor, despite the overwhelming evidence that shows how Israel is currently and has oppressed.
Again, for the 5th time, HAMAS WOULDN’T EXIST WITHOUT ISRAEL’S OPPRESSION. It cannot be one-sided when one side created the other through oppression.
When Arabs were the majority with the power the killed and drove the jews out in the name of nationalism
Okay and nationalism/being hostile to immigrants isn’t the same as colonizing, intentionally destroying the culture of, and oppressing an indigenous people. Why are you conflating the two? It’s a false equivalency, as is every other comparison you make regarding this situation because you’re blinded by your hatred of religion (and quite possibly also some racism in there).
And both groups disgust me, and would hurt and destroy my way of life if they had the power to do so
Again, you’re conflating Hamas and Palestinians. There are Christian and atheist Palestinians, and many Arab Palestinians who are not extremist.
If pslestinian Arabs wanted to use the dhemmi system when they had power
Okay so I’m not sure if you your hateful little brain is capable of comprehending this, but people do not deserve to live in apartheid and have their entire peoples oppressed and put through genocide because some of their great-great-grandparents may have supported a discriminatory power structure that could have been implemented.
Bunch of hypocrites
The only hypocrite here is you, using your hatred of religion to justify and minimize human rights abuses, while whining nonstop about how hateful religion is towards your way of life.
We get it, you’re a racist atheist who enjoys seeing religious people kill each other. Now go fuck off and stop spreading hate and misinformation about a situation that has enough of that.
Sorry its just so rare to find someone who completely understands every aspect of a 100 year war and has all the answers.
You don’t have to understand every aspect to know that Israel is the aggressor, which you continue to try to cast doubt on. Which leads me to believe you’re either a Zionist or otherwise motivated to make Palestinians look bad, based on your comment history and refusal to acknowledge things such as Israel literally helping create Hamas, and your reluctance to distinguish between Hamas and Palestinians.
You’re either letting your hatred for religion dictate your views, or you’re bigoted.
And ofc pre-Nakba matters, but Nakba was the beginning of the apartheid that Palestinians are currently living under, and perhaps the single greatest determining event in the conflict, in addition to being the start of the state of Israel and thus organized violence by Israel against Palestine.
Didn’t I already explain this to you like 5 times?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nakba
Like I said in my previous comments addressing your ignorance, EDUCATE YOURSELF on the situation if you insist on commenting on it.
Yes, a wiki is an EXCELLENT idea. IDK if there are any plans to add wiki functionality on Lemme, but man it’d be nice.
I’m not saying that. I’m saying that holding America up as a standard and saying that we’re somehow better is hypocritical and dangerous because it helps to justify/overlook shit like what’s happening in Palestine rn, and I’m sick of the general mindset exactly because it has helped lead to the ignorance and complacency we see with a genocide that is fueled largely by American desire to retain influence in that region for capitalistic purposes, with no regard for human rights.
I mean yeah no shit, they’ve been at it for thousands of years lmao.
And, as I’ve said elsewhere I was more getting at the human rights atrocities perpetrated by the US which still have great effect on Vietnam.
I’m in no way trying to justify anything. Again, I’m just saying I’m sick of seeing people hold the US up as “hey look we’re better” because I really don’t know that we are. We care about human rights at home, to an extent, but we don’t give af who that affects in other parts of the world. Is that really better than China pretending to care about it’s citizens with communism while abusing their human rights and exercising insane governmental control over their lives?
The US has been and continues to be the direct and indirect perpetrator of a lot of evils, and the more I learn about these things, the more I dislike seeing America characterized as a standard of morality, because it directly reflects propaganda which has allowed for many of these atrocities to happen.